Nuclear Fusion Collab

Work together on Algodoo projects here.

Nuclear Fusion Collab

Postby TC42 » Sat Jan 29, 2011 5:49 pm

Due to an outstanding sense of irony, and the fact that I actually read the contest rules and guidelines, I bring you the Nuclear Fusion Collab. The goal of this topic is to create nuclear fusion in Algodoo/Phun, and also find a use for it once we have created it.

My idea for it is to use circles with different collision groups scripted with oncollide so that when they collide, they stick together due to gravity/attraction, and also spawn more circles when they collide. Unfortunately, you could only simulate ~7 atoms with that arrangement.

So please submit your ideas for nuclear fusion, and have PHUN (or algodoo)
Image
Spambot wrote:Nowadays, memes usually are studied less in the field of biology, but more with the arena of psychology along with sociology. But, the major area of a meme, getting embraced and imitated all the time is what’s at any core connected with any meme.
User avatar
TC42
 
Posts: 984
Joined: Sun Jan 09, 2011 1:53 pm
Location: $ sudo apt get-install sandwich_

Re: Nuclear Fusion Collab

Postby ducky21 » Sat Jan 29, 2011 5:51 pm

I think we should make a atom phunlet first. This way we can find a way to simulate decay, isatopes, and chain reactions.

Edit: I assume you want a uranium reaction?
User avatar
ducky21
 
Posts: 301
Joined: Tue Aug 03, 2010 8:58 pm

Re: Nuclear Fusion Collab

Postby davidz40 » Sat Jan 29, 2011 7:05 pm

If You mean hydrogen fusion, that should be doable without much lag. The simplest fusion is the one inside the sun:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:FusionintheSun.svg

Just use both linear and quadratic attraction to make atoms attract themselves at very close distance (strong nuclear force) and repel at long distance (electrostatic repulsion of the same charges).
Only major problem might be proton->neutron+positron script that does that reaction in right moments.
Spawning and trying to visualise gamma rays/neutrinos is rather pointless so that can be skipped.
Phundamentalist
User avatar
davidz40
 
Posts: 438
Joined: Sun Sep 06, 2009 10:30 am

Re: Nuclear Fusion Collab

Postby TC42 » Sat Jan 29, 2011 11:09 pm

Yes, I was thinking about hydrogen fusion. I'll try to make a scene with it soon.
Image
Spambot wrote:Nowadays, memes usually are studied less in the field of biology, but more with the arena of psychology along with sociology. But, the major area of a meme, getting embraced and imitated all the time is what’s at any core connected with any meme.
User avatar
TC42
 
Posts: 984
Joined: Sun Jan 09, 2011 1:53 pm
Location: $ sudo apt get-install sandwich_

Re: Nuclear Fusion Collab

Postby Someone Else » Sat Jan 29, 2011 11:47 pm

Look Here!

Or Here:
Rating: rated 7.4
Filesize: 10.33 kB
Comments: 4
Ratings: 9
download
Matthias Wandel is epic, in my humble opinion.
I love my brain...
TC42 wrote:Also, your sig is too big, please change it.

ARE YA HAPPY NOW?????

Thymechanic/Phundamentalist

Recently, I discovered something a lot of you probably already knew: Minecraft is awesome.
Due to this, I may not be as active as usual for a while.
User avatar
Someone Else
 
Posts: 1147
Joined: Sun Nov 21, 2010 10:53 pm
Location: The Milky Way Galaxy

Re: Nuclear Fusion Collab

Postby TC42 » Sun Jan 30, 2011 12:40 am

Well then, that pretty much makes this collab obsolete, although I would like to run a larger simulation. :|
Image
Spambot wrote:Nowadays, memes usually are studied less in the field of biology, but more with the arena of psychology along with sociology. But, the major area of a meme, getting embraced and imitated all the time is what’s at any core connected with any meme.
User avatar
TC42
 
Posts: 984
Joined: Sun Jan 09, 2011 1:53 pm
Location: $ sudo apt get-install sandwich_

Re: Nuclear Fusion Collab

Postby Someone Else » Sun Jan 30, 2011 12:42 am

TC42 wrote:Well then, that pretty much makes this collab obsolete, although I would like to run a larger simulation. :|

Go right ahead.
Matthias Wandel is epic, in my humble opinion.
I love my brain...
TC42 wrote:Also, your sig is too big, please change it.

ARE YA HAPPY NOW?????

Thymechanic/Phundamentalist

Recently, I discovered something a lot of you probably already knew: Minecraft is awesome.
Due to this, I may not be as active as usual for a while.
User avatar
Someone Else
 
Posts: 1147
Joined: Sun Nov 21, 2010 10:53 pm
Location: The Milky Way Galaxy

Re: Nuclear Fusion Collab

Postby davidz40 » Sun Jan 30, 2011 11:33 am

That one is nice, but seems to be a bit overcomplicated, and protons cannot turn into neutrons, so the collab is not obsolete.
Phundamentalist
User avatar
davidz40
 
Posts: 438
Joined: Sun Sep 06, 2009 10:30 am

Re: Nuclear Fusion Collab

Postby Someone Else » Sun Jan 30, 2011 4:24 pm

HOW are you going to turn protons into neutrons? :wtf:
Though, I cannot help but agree that Conun's scene is very complicated, if not excessively so.
Hmm, maybe have two circles, the outer one has linear "electromagnetic" repulsion, the inner one quadratic "strong force" attraction. To turn protons into neutrons, kill the outer circle.
Electrons... Two circles, one with stronger, linear "electromagnetic" attraction WITH HETEROCOLLIDE so they would attract protons, the other circle with a linear repulsion so they repel each other.

Revision

Four collideSets- A just allows collisions to work right.
B is the strong force- a quadratic attraction in protons and neutrons.
C is the electromagnetic attraction between positive and negative charges- Linear with heteroCollide, with water in positive charges, without water in negative charges.
D is the electromagnetic repulsion between like charges- Linear, but weaker than the attraction. The attraction would drown it out between opposite charges.

At least, I assume that attraction with heteroCollide works as I imagine it to...
Matthias Wandel is epic, in my humble opinion.
I love my brain...
TC42 wrote:Also, your sig is too big, please change it.

ARE YA HAPPY NOW?????

Thymechanic/Phundamentalist

Recently, I discovered something a lot of you probably already knew: Minecraft is awesome.
Due to this, I may not be as active as usual for a while.
User avatar
Someone Else
 
Posts: 1147
Joined: Sun Nov 21, 2010 10:53 pm
Location: The Milky Way Galaxy

Re: Nuclear Fusion Collab

Postby davidz40 » Sun Jan 30, 2011 5:51 pm

Proton can turn into neutrons and vice cersa, when there are too many of one kind.
proton->neutron + positron
neutron->proton + electron

Organising collidesets as SomeoneElse said is good idea, that should work. I'm gonna test that soon. But I don't have any idea how to Implement the reactions above.
Phundamentalist
User avatar
davidz40
 
Posts: 438
Joined: Sun Sep 06, 2009 10:30 am

Re: Nuclear Fusion Collab

Postby davidz40 » Sun Jan 30, 2011 7:41 pm

While toying with SomeoneElse's ideas, I came up with single collision set charges. We have first step towards super simplicity :thumbup:
Rating: rated 5.6
Filesize: 35.09 kB
Comments: 1
Ratings: 2
download

Note that it uses positive and negative mass, so charges have different masses. This can be easily offset by changinc collision A (colliding) circles density.
Phundamentalist
User avatar
davidz40
 
Posts: 438
Joined: Sun Sep 06, 2009 10:30 am

Re: Nuclear Fusion Collab

Postby Someone Else » Mon Jan 31, 2011 3:14 am

Rating: rated 5.6
Filesize: 49.92 kB
Comments: 1
Ratings: 2
download

I, in the scene description wrote:Credit to davidz- He invented the idea of one-collideSet electromagnetism.
I added some other stuff, so it is a somewhat accurate simulation of NINE subatomic particles.

I also randomly included two carbon atoms fusing into one magnesium atom.

It uses four collision layers , three have attraction.


Okay, I am SO joining this collab. I simulated electrons, muons, protons, their neutral counterparts (Neutrinos, neutrons), and their antimatter counterparts.

There is no big explosion when particles and their antiparticles collide. I might be able to do that, but I am not sure.
Use controllerAcc to identify the particles.

Not exactly super simplicity, but better than Conun's. This has a description.
I also changed the material on the gray, colliding circles to restitution = friction = 0.
Matthias Wandel is epic, in my humble opinion.
I love my brain...
TC42 wrote:Also, your sig is too big, please change it.

ARE YA HAPPY NOW?????

Thymechanic/Phundamentalist

Recently, I discovered something a lot of you probably already knew: Minecraft is awesome.
Due to this, I may not be as active as usual for a while.
User avatar
Someone Else
 
Posts: 1147
Joined: Sun Nov 21, 2010 10:53 pm
Location: The Milky Way Galaxy

Re: Nuclear Fusion Collab

Postby Gear97 » Wed Mar 09, 2011 6:54 pm

Hmm... OK I am joining this collab :thumbup:
I have some ideas...
And why only making one kind of nuclear fusion ? We can make more! (Deuterium-Tritium is boring, lets try Deuterium-Helium3 ;) )
What's next ? Making the atoms and changing the protons to neutrons ? ( I am a little bit confused :crazy: )
:roll:
Also if you guys are trying to reproduce the stars cycle, you will need photon particles (gamma rays) ;) .
I can help if the collab need script for explosions, light and partical reactions :)
Gears are my favorite mechanism. Why do you think I have this username ? ;)
Make sure to spend some time to see my work http://www.algodoo.com/algobox/profile.php?id=96, just to kill sometime ;)
PS: Gear97™ Is a trademark from me. Any unauthorized use of the term "Gear" for usernames or other naming ideas will be punished.
User avatar
Gear97
 
Posts: 146
Joined: Sat Jan 02, 2010 5:34 pm
Location: Brazil

Re: Nuclear Fusion Collab

Postby Someone Else » Sun Mar 13, 2011 6:03 am

Uhh... :groan:...

I *think* we are trying to build subatomic particles that will behave more-or-less realistically and can keep a fusion reaction going. However, I am starting to doubt that this is possible without scripts. Scripts. SCRIPTS. SCRIPTS!! SSCCRRIIPPTTSS MUAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA!!!!

Oh wow... there I go again...

And I think you should tell me how deuterium-helium3 works. If it uses beta decay, then that needs to be Thymed. Probably using the same technology as your fusion sim. And make it actually spit out an electron!

And I might create matter-antimatter reactions with my atom sim. Now that I know the perfect technique (collideSet = 0; airFrictionMult = -inf ... oh wait, there is no air. OOPS :oops: )

Anyway, script whatever you think needs to be scripted.
Matthias Wandel is epic, in my humble opinion.
I love my brain...
TC42 wrote:Also, your sig is too big, please change it.

ARE YA HAPPY NOW?????

Thymechanic/Phundamentalist

Recently, I discovered something a lot of you probably already knew: Minecraft is awesome.
Due to this, I may not be as active as usual for a while.
User avatar
Someone Else
 
Posts: 1147
Joined: Sun Nov 21, 2010 10:53 pm
Location: The Milky Way Galaxy

Re: Nuclear Fusion Collab

Postby davidz40 » Mon Mar 14, 2011 1:23 pm

For deleting, maybe use:
collideset=G (or any unused one)
killer=true
spawn collision G killer upon itself.
Phundamentalist
User avatar
davidz40
 
Posts: 438
Joined: Sun Sep 06, 2009 10:30 am

Re: Nuclear Fusion Collab

Postby Someone Else » Tue Mar 15, 2011 2:32 pm

Or, better, use collideSet = 0; airFrictionMult = -inf, but leave air on and have the airFrictionMult of everything equal to zero. Sometime. I've got a busy schedule [English homework] and a lot of projects backed up in my mind where I hope they are not being forgotten.
Matthias Wandel is epic, in my humble opinion.
I love my brain...
TC42 wrote:Also, your sig is too big, please change it.

ARE YA HAPPY NOW?????

Thymechanic/Phundamentalist

Recently, I discovered something a lot of you probably already knew: Minecraft is awesome.
Due to this, I may not be as active as usual for a while.
User avatar
Someone Else
 
Posts: 1147
Joined: Sun Nov 21, 2010 10:53 pm
Location: The Milky Way Galaxy

Re: Nuclear Fusion Collab

Postby Gear97 » Thu Mar 17, 2011 9:11 pm

Ok! :D Deuterium + Helium-3 = Helium-4 + one proton ! Deuterium has 1 proton and 1 neutrons, and Helium-3 has 1 neutrons and 2 protons, when they combine they "explode" in the Helium-4 and proton... The proton is a charged particle as we all know, its conversion to eletricity is more easy than the conversion of a neutron's energy into eletricity.
This reaction is quite simple :) . I don't know but I think that deuterium-he3 does not needs scripting to simulate the particles ;)
Gears are my favorite mechanism. Why do you think I have this username ? ;)
Make sure to spend some time to see my work http://www.algodoo.com/algobox/profile.php?id=96, just to kill sometime ;)
PS: Gear97™ Is a trademark from me. Any unauthorized use of the term "Gear" for usernames or other naming ideas will be punished.
User avatar
Gear97
 
Posts: 146
Joined: Sat Jan 02, 2010 5:34 pm
Location: Brazil

Re: Nuclear Fusion Collab

Postby Someone Else » Fri Mar 18, 2011 2:33 pm

Hmm. Lithium-5 spits out a proton, huh?

I would've thought Lithium-5 would beta decay into helium-5, spitting out an electron, and then that would spit out a neutron. This, I think, would be more fun, if not more realistic.

And come to think of it, I would think that the helium-5 would beta decay, spitting out a helium-4. This would leave only a neutron, so, I guess that's the explanation for that. Neutrons have much less mass than helium atoms, so Newton's Second Law of Motion says it should accelerate more.

EDIT: Oops, I just realized that I said the helium-5 should BETA decay, when I should've said ALPHA decay. And I think beta decay also spits out a neutrino.

And also, beta decay turns a NEUTRON into a PROTON and an electron. Man, I was confused. It was fairly early morning, though. So, this collab should just stick to lithium-5 spits out an proton. And how will proton energy be harvested? By dissolving them into a metal to generate a positive electric charge? So electrons from another source can be drawn in?
On the other hand, the proton would probably have an electron stuck to it. Trying to harvest this hydrogen atom seems kinda pointless.
Matthias Wandel is epic, in my humble opinion.
I love my brain...
TC42 wrote:Also, your sig is too big, please change it.

ARE YA HAPPY NOW?????

Thymechanic/Phundamentalist

Recently, I discovered something a lot of you probably already knew: Minecraft is awesome.
Due to this, I may not be as active as usual for a while.
User avatar
Someone Else
 
Posts: 1147
Joined: Sun Nov 21, 2010 10:53 pm
Location: The Milky Way Galaxy

Re: Nuclear Fusion Collab

Postby TC42 » Fri Mar 18, 2011 10:11 pm

Sorry I haven't done anything, but this went way beyond my scope of knowledge :crazy: I'll have to read up on my nuclear fission/fusion...
Image
Spambot wrote:Nowadays, memes usually are studied less in the field of biology, but more with the arena of psychology along with sociology. But, the major area of a meme, getting embraced and imitated all the time is what’s at any core connected with any meme.
User avatar
TC42
 
Posts: 984
Joined: Sun Jan 09, 2011 1:53 pm
Location: $ sudo apt get-install sandwich_

Re: Nuclear Fusion Collab

Postby Gear97 » Sun Mar 20, 2011 4:06 pm

Hey Someone Else :) I was confused about the "new nucleus" formed in the process too.
Also proton energy can be harvested the way you said or they hit a magnetic field and create "tension" and thus generating eletricity directly from the particles! This reaction has an easiest energy harvesting. :)
Gears are my favorite mechanism. Why do you think I have this username ? ;)
Make sure to spend some time to see my work http://www.algodoo.com/algobox/profile.php?id=96, just to kill sometime ;)
PS: Gear97™ Is a trademark from me. Any unauthorized use of the term "Gear" for usernames or other naming ideas will be punished.
User avatar
Gear97
 
Posts: 146
Joined: Sat Jan 02, 2010 5:34 pm
Location: Brazil

Re: Nuclear Fusion Collab

Postby Someone Else » Thu Mar 24, 2011 4:02 pm

Rating: rated 5
Filesize: 44.05 kB
Comments: 0
Ratings: 1
download

Check this out.
Matthias Wandel is epic, in my humble opinion.
I love my brain...
TC42 wrote:Also, your sig is too big, please change it.

ARE YA HAPPY NOW?????

Thymechanic/Phundamentalist

Recently, I discovered something a lot of you probably already knew: Minecraft is awesome.
Due to this, I may not be as active as usual for a while.
User avatar
Someone Else
 
Posts: 1147
Joined: Sun Nov 21, 2010 10:53 pm
Location: The Milky Way Galaxy

Re: Nuclear Fusion Collab

Postby Gear97 » Thu Mar 24, 2011 8:25 pm

OK. Nice work with the matter-antimatter reaction :thumbup: ! But the energy is released in the form of high energy photons (gamma rays) and not in the form of direct heat. But nice work it really seems to be very energetic ;).
In the case of gamma rays, photons could be withe circles that move at relatively high speeds and die when they touch some other particle (just like your scene but withe lol). (transfering its motion aka HEAT to the other particle).
I will start to script some things to this collab when I have time ... (I am helping Davizex321 right now)
Gears are my favorite mechanism. Why do you think I have this username ? ;)
Make sure to spend some time to see my work http://www.algodoo.com/algobox/profile.php?id=96, just to kill sometime ;)
PS: Gear97™ Is a trademark from me. Any unauthorized use of the term "Gear" for usernames or other naming ideas will be punished.
User avatar
Gear97
 
Posts: 146
Joined: Sat Jan 02, 2010 5:34 pm
Location: Brazil

Re: Nuclear Fusion Collab

Postby Someone Else » Fri Mar 25, 2011 3:00 pm

I should mention a few things now that I have time:
  • The strong force in my sim seems way too strong- Helium-5 is very stable, as is a sufficiently small ball of protons. Sufficiently small is still pretty big.
  • The density of the spawned circles is equal to color(3) of the outside circle. That's why the border is so dark.
  • If Lithium-5 does undergo proton emission, the proton would not have an electron from its own atom, but would pick up one of the gazillions that are floating around. Maybe we could try to suck some of these off thru an electric charge off to the side?
  • Maybe we should try to do "cold fusion".
    • Use electricity to break heavy water into oxygen, deutirium, and tritium.
    • Then the hydrogen isotopes get dissolved into palladium (the electrode where the hydrogen is already attracted to).
    • There, they fuse as expected. The heat from this can be directly captured. The palladium acts as a catalyst.
  • I discovered how to nest the List BBCode.
Matthias Wandel is epic, in my humble opinion.
I love my brain...
TC42 wrote:Also, your sig is too big, please change it.

ARE YA HAPPY NOW?????

Thymechanic/Phundamentalist

Recently, I discovered something a lot of you probably already knew: Minecraft is awesome.
Due to this, I may not be as active as usual for a while.
User avatar
Someone Else
 
Posts: 1147
Joined: Sun Nov 21, 2010 10:53 pm
Location: The Milky Way Galaxy

Re: Nuclear Fusion Collab

Postby Gear97 » Mon Mar 28, 2011 8:27 pm

Great ideas man ! I am very happy about your ideas :) Cold fusion is another "good shot" I am pretty sure I will help.
Maybe you need to make small adjustements to the attraction of your particles until everything is fine (helium-5 being stable is :crazy: ).
Gears are my favorite mechanism. Why do you think I have this username ? ;)
Make sure to spend some time to see my work http://www.algodoo.com/algobox/profile.php?id=96, just to kill sometime ;)
PS: Gear97™ Is a trademark from me. Any unauthorized use of the term "Gear" for usernames or other naming ideas will be punished.
User avatar
Gear97
 
Posts: 146
Joined: Sat Jan 02, 2010 5:34 pm
Location: Brazil

Re: Nuclear Fusion Collab

Postby Someone Else » Tue Mar 29, 2011 5:46 pm

The main problem with my atom sim is that a ball of neutrons will ALWAYS be stable.
If you can figure out how to fix that, please do.
Maybe add a circle with small negative linear attraction to the neutrons?
On- I think- collision D? One would think this would add up as more neutrons pile up, and would prevent balls of neutrons IF the neutron Strong Force (the white circle) is on heteroCollide WITH water,
and the proton/antiproton is on heteroCollide WITHOUT water.
But that presents the problem of the anti-SF on the electrons and muons... Maybe add collision E to those?
Matthias Wandel is epic, in my humble opinion.
I love my brain...
TC42 wrote:Also, your sig is too big, please change it.

ARE YA HAPPY NOW?????

Thymechanic/Phundamentalist

Recently, I discovered something a lot of you probably already knew: Minecraft is awesome.
Due to this, I may not be as active as usual for a while.
User avatar
Someone Else
 
Posts: 1147
Joined: Sun Nov 21, 2010 10:53 pm
Location: The Milky Way Galaxy

Next

Return to Collab forum

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 1 guest