Early Aircraft Collab (1903 - 1920)

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Re: Early Aircraft Collab (1903 - 1920)

Postby Wild Bill » Sat Feb 19, 2011 4:04 am

Mold, I looked at your plane and the hinge shouldnt have auto brake so the engine can return back to center when no control input is used, and the springs need to be attached to the wing, and the outer edges of the engine and not so close to the pivot center. Use a couple of boxes to limit how far the engine can move on up and down control. You can move the boxes to allow more or less travel for up or down.
Then use the length of the springs to tune the plane to fly straight and make sure the springs are strong enuff to keep the engine centered when no control input is used and that it doesnt move around while going up or down.
Within 2 minutes I had your plane flying fairly well just doing what I said above.

I think its better to use two engines, one on the front for forward thrust and one on the tail that controls up and down but using one on the front only can work also.

Like Dare said, look at his plane close, his stuff flies very good.
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Re: Early Aircraft Collab (1903 - 1920)

Postby mold999 » Sat Feb 19, 2011 5:01 am

@Someone Else:
The above post was intended for me correct?

If so, thank you.

@Wild Bill:
Not to offend you, but I'm a little confused about your advice. can you upload the scene you made, so I can see what you mean?

Thanks anyway, though.
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Re: Early Aircraft Collab (1903 - 1920)

Postby Wild Bill » Sat Feb 19, 2011 5:50 am

If you were already based on Dares plane look at how that one is made.
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Re: Early Aircraft Collab (1903 - 1920)

Postby Dare » Sat Feb 19, 2011 6:17 am

Wild Bill, that is a great idea to use a second engine for an elevator! I will have to use this, and upload it for the collab. :thumbup:
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Re: Early Aircraft Collab (1903 - 1920)

Postby Someone Else » Sat Feb 19, 2011 6:42 am

@mold999- Yes, my last post here was indeed aimed at you. Big things get knocked around a lot less than small things.

Translating Wild Bill's post:

:arrow: Don't make the hinge the whole engine pivots on auto-braked, so the engine will swing back to its original position.
:arrow: Use two boxes to limit how much the engine can rotate.
:arrow: Use the length of the springs to adjust where the engine sits when you release the controls, so the plane flies more or less level.
:arrow: He managed to accomplish this in two minutes.
:arrow: He thinks it's better to use one engine as thrust and another at the back for elevators, like in the second or third plane in this collab. Your design also works, though.
:arrow: Study Dare's planes. They work well.

Also, I might suggest using D-Wings. That is, those invented by davidz40.
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Re: Early Aircraft Collab (1903 - 1920)

Postby Nait » Sat Feb 19, 2011 6:57 am

I've made a plane, but I have some problems :(
Maybe somebody (davidz40, I mean you)))) want to look and help me (please)))?
Ok, here's the scene
Rating: rated 5.6
Filesize: 0.72 MB
Comments: 1
Ratings: 2
download

When I set wing motors into "fly" state (with main engine turned off), they can pull the plane up. The same thing with elevator. But I can't make them working in the flight... :|
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Re: Early Aircraft Collab (1903 - 1920)

Postby davidz40 » Sat Feb 19, 2011 11:45 am

Rating: rated 6.4
Filesize: 52.39 kB
Comments: 1
Ratings: 4
download

Fixed. Things changed:
-Added high air friction "fin" on the tail bottom to balance out friction of upper wing.
-Added negative air friction parts to set total air friction at reasonable level
-wings strength increased
-flipped tail wing (it was upside down)
-moved centre of mass towards front
-made whole thing a bit lighter (but i'm not sure)
-made engine weaker

Now it flies reasonaly good. Top speed is under 100km/h, takeoff speed about 60km/h, plane stalls at over 50 degree climb.
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Re: Early Aircraft Collab (1903 - 1920)

Postby mold999 » Sat Feb 19, 2011 6:24 pm

@Someone Else:

What are "D Wings"?

I searched them and came up with a whole lot of junk.

@anybody else on this collab:

How can I make my engine fly straight? It always leans to the left or right.
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Re: Early Aircraft Collab (1903 - 1920)

Postby davidz40 » Sat Feb 19, 2011 9:04 pm

-Just change the steering motor strength to few thousand Nm. Your density motor changes circles density to 1000, and that makes it pretty heavy. That's why it falls down.
High air friction parts must be hinged to the aircraft body to work properly
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Re: Early Aircraft Collab (1903 - 1920)

Postby Someone Else » Sun Feb 20, 2011 1:31 am

D-wings are what I call davidz40's scriptless wing. Very interesting concept, by the way.

And I might make a plane with them sometime...or maybe I will add some velocity-measuring code to my density engine. :think:
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Re: Early Aircraft Collab (1903 - 1920)

Postby davidz40 » Sun Feb 20, 2011 1:18 pm

I upgraded my wing system once more. Now it can lift over 500kg, and has flaps.
Air friction is very low, probably a bit too low. Some combinations of high speed and low angle of attack might result in plane acceleration. This can be easily regulated by negative air friction red box on the front.
Rating: rated 7.1
Filesize: 37.93 kB
Comments: 5
Ratings: 8
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Re: Early Aircraft Collab (1903 - 1920)

Postby Nxdt » Sun Feb 20, 2011 5:04 pm

Lol, if you just watch it glide and don't interfere it gains altitude and speed until it crashes into the top killer plane. very nice wing though.
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Re: Early Aircraft Collab (1903 - 1920)

Postby Dare » Sun Feb 20, 2011 11:07 pm

I reckon you should've uploaded it as a V2, to save the first one for history. But your choice ;)
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Re: Early Aircraft Collab (1903 - 1920)

Postby Someone Else » Mon Feb 21, 2011 12:28 am

Yes, I cannot help but agree with Dare. I never edit a scene unless I discover a horrible flaw. But, different minds don't think alike... to paraphrase the old saying.

And how does negative air friction prevent physically impossible acceleration? :wtf:
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Re: Early Aircraft Collab (1903 - 1920)

Postby Nait » Mon Feb 21, 2011 5:48 am

davidz40, wow, I'm really in awe of you! :D
Now, I'll try to make another plane, looking at how you have fixed this one.
BTW, it works good in algodoo :thumbup:
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Re: Early Aircraft Collab (1903 - 1920)

Postby davidz40 » Mon Feb 21, 2011 1:06 pm

SomeoneElse: Negative air friction is of course the source of impossible acceleration, I meant that it should be set a bit lower.
Now I'm going to create some WW1 hydroplane, haven't decided which one yet.
I edited the scene bacause yet-another-glider-scene seemed like spamming. But looking at some other people's uploads...
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Re: Early Aircraft Collab (1903 - 1920)

Postby Dare » Mon Feb 21, 2011 1:59 pm

Are you sure you are building a hydroplane?

I think floatplane or flying boat is what you mean, right?
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Re: Early Aircraft Collab (1903 - 1920)

Postby davidz40 » Tue Feb 22, 2011 4:57 pm

Yes, floatplane of course.
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Re: Early Aircraft Collab (1903 - 1920)

Postby TC42 » Wed Feb 23, 2011 3:43 am

Like this one?
[scene]52048[/scene]
My prototype.
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Re: Early Aircraft Collab (1903 - 1920)

Postby Dare » Wed Feb 23, 2011 5:08 am

WTF is that?? :wtf:
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Re: Early Aircraft Collab (1903 - 1920)

Postby TC42 » Wed Feb 23, 2011 10:37 pm

My version of a float-plane; so sorry it doesn't fly very well, but I'm not good at that sort of thing. I was thinking about how to make a float-plane without mass lag, so I remembered Kilinich's hovercraft...

Also is that a "WTF is this crappy scene on mah collab?"
or a "WTF that is amazing how did you do it?"
or is it just a plain old "WTF"?
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Re: Early Aircraft Collab (1903 - 1920)

Postby Dare » Wed Feb 23, 2011 11:08 pm

It was "WTF" in a funny sort of way. I actually laughed when it started floating up into the air and sort of wobbling around the place while water leaked out, it was extremely funny to watch :P
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Re: Early Aircraft Collab (1903 - 1920)

Postby Dare » Sat Feb 26, 2011 1:00 pm

Hey guys check out this website I found!
http://www.wwiaviation.com/index.html
It's got tons of info about early WW1 aircraft and tons of side views to trace into Algodoo!

To see the profiles, go into Click to Enter > Table of Contents > Profile Galleries

Happy flying!
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Re: Early Aircraft Collab (1903 - 1920)

Postby davidz40 » Sat Feb 26, 2011 8:13 pm

OMG that website is really great! :clap:
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Re: Early Aircraft Collab (1903 - 1920)

Postby TC42 » Sat Feb 26, 2011 11:21 pm

W00T W00T SIDE-VIEWS! :P I must make something awesome with this. Gold star for you! :clap:
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