[Algobox] Algodoo Tag Team

Work together on Algodoo projects here.

[Algobox] Algodoo Tag Team

Postby gradyfitz » Sun Dec 05, 2010 12:25 pm

Tag List and Progress - Google Wave
Progress 0%

-- Tags --
Algobox has a feature for tagging scenes with appropriate key words, "tags", these tags help people search for what they are looking for. This is an extremely good way of showing people what they want to see, unfortunately, because most scenes never get tagged and tag definitions are not readily available, this system isn't too useful.

-- Objective --
The objective of the Algodoo Tag Team is twofold, to tag every scene, if this is broken up into 250 - 1000 scenes per block, it will only take 127 - 32 blocks, which is quite achievable. The other objective is to establish a list of tags with clear definitions that allow anyone to add their own tags without missing any that could potentially classify their scene as something someone would like to see.

-- Means --
It is planned that the project will be organized on Google Wave until completion, this allows for multiple user administration and the ability to appoint extra users should some become inactive, this allows for the continuation of the project when administrators are unable to assist for long periods of time. It is planned that tags will be kept on the wave, and updated by administrators, this ensures that tags that are too specific are not added (i.e bus, car, truck, pickup, semi, etc. for vehicle).

Scenes will be broken up into 250 - 1000 scene blocks (this may be a number to decide on), with the exclusion of the first block of 992 (17408 - 18400). Users can pick a block and can complete it themselves (in order to do so, please go from the first scene to the last scene in the group and keep a progress note so if you stop then others are able to take over for you), If you have any doubts about which tags to add to a particular scene, note this scene and someone else will add/suggest tags.

If you want to suggest a new tag, please post the name of the tag (singular, under 16 characters), a description of the tag (it may be "cleaned up" a little after) and an example scene that falls under this tag.

-- Current Participants --
Grady
Mystery
Chronos
Electronicboy
Ducky21

-- Guidelines --
- Download and investigate scenes thoroughly before adding tags, this will keep tags as accurate as possible.
- Apply tags that overlap where appropriate (eg. Thyme, Mechanics and Thymechanics for scenes with the "Thymechanics" tag).

-- Sets --
Green - Finished
Red - Assigned/Working on
Black - Unassigned and Unfinished
- 1 - 2 - 3 - 4 - 5 - 6 - 7 - 8 - 9 - 10 - 11 - 12 - 13 - 14 - 15 - 16 - 17 - 18 - 19 - 20 - 21 - 22 - 23 - 24 - 25 - 26 - 27 - 28 - 29 - 30 - 31 - 32 - 33 - 34 - 35 - 36 - 37 - 38 - 39 - 40 - 41 - 42 - 43 - 44 - 45 - 46 - 47 - 48 - 49 - 50 - 51 - 52 - 53 - 54 - 55 - 56 - 57 - 58 - 59 - 60 - 61 - 62 - 63 - 64 - 65 - 66 - 67 - 68 - 69 - 70 - 71 - 72 - 73 - 74 - 75 - 76 - 77 - 78 - 79 - 80 - 81 - 82 - 83 - 84 - 85 - 86 - 87 - 88 - 89 - 90 - 91 - 92 - 93 - 94 - 95 - 96 - 97 - 98 - 99 - 100 - 101 - 102 - 103 - 104 - 105 - 106 - 107 - 108 - 109 - 110 - 111 - 112 - 113 - 114 - 115 - 116 - 117 - 118 - 119 - 120 - 121 - 122 - 123 - 124 - 125 - 126 - 127 -

-- Tags so far --
Go to Tag List and Progress - Google Wave for an up to date tag list.


THYME - A scene involving usage of Thyme as a primary function.
THYMECHANICS - A scene involving both the usage of Thyme and Mechanics as equal components.
THYME DEMO - A scene that exhibits a new usage of Thyme that has previously not been used.
BASIC THYME- Thyme is used in this scene but in not the primary function.
MOUSE CONTROL - A scene that uses the mouse and a secondary or primary controller.

ARTISTIC - A scene designed for the purpose of looking aesthetically pleasing.
CARTOON - A scene involving Cartoonish imagery. This may not be the primary function.
PHOTOREALISM - A scene involving realistic imagery. This may not be the primary function.
DEPTH - A scene that simulates perspective.
ANIMATION - A scene that is designed to show a non interactive set of movements. Such as [animation] Titanic Sinking or Burning flame animation

MECHANICAL - A scene involving usage of mechanics as a primary function.
WEAPON - A scene involving a weapon with moving parts. (Not things like swords)
WALKING - A scene involving a system emulating walking of some kind.
ROCKET - A scene in which Rocketry to any extent is used.
VEHICLE - a scene using mechanical design to make a car. This includes up to any extent from gear boxes to basic motors.
LAND VEHICLE - Vehicle with it's primary usage on LAND
WATER VEHICLE - Vehicle with it's primary usage on or in WATER
AIR VEHICLE - Vehicle with it's primary usage in the air (I.e Flying)
BREAKABLE - A scene that contains a component which can take damage or be destroyed.
RUBE GOLDBERG - A scene using overcomplicated methods to achieve a simple objective

GAME - A scene in which an objective is provided (including getting a high score).
LINEAR GAME - A scene in which the objective involves moving from one point to another.
SCORE GAME - A scene in which the objective involves achieving a high score.
RACING GAME- A scene where racing is the primary focus.
MULTIPLAYER GAME - A game where two or more players can play.
COMBAT GAME- A scene where combat is the main focus.
SURVIVAL GAME - A scene where the objective is to keep from losing for the longest time.

RETRO - A scene that uses old techniques from previous versions of Phun/Algodoo. Examples of this include deliberately not using textures and no thyme (Achieving goals usually done with thyme)
TEXTURELESS - A scene in which having no textures is a primary component.
PHUNDAMENTALIST - A scene with no Thyme used.

EDUCATIONAL - A scene which demonstrates educational aspects.

RAGDOLL - A scene which contains an object made of many geometries that will fall fluidly.

-----

Is anyone interested?
Last edited by gradyfitz on Wed Dec 29, 2010 12:37 am, edited 12 times in total.
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Re: [Algobox] Algodoo Tag Team

Postby Chronos » Sun Dec 05, 2010 2:12 pm

I might help out a little.

gradyfitz wrote:VEHICLE - a scene using mechanical design to make a car. This includes up to any extent from gear boxes to basic motors.
LAND VEHICLE - Vehicle with it's primary usage on LAND
WATER VEHICLE - Vehicle with it's primary usage on or in WATER
AIR VEHICLE - Vehicle with it's primary usage in the air (I.e Flying)

I think that the types of vehicle tags should be seperate. E.g., if it's a car the tags should be "land, vehicle" instead of "land vehicle". This eleminates the need to have a "[type] vehicle" tag and a "vehicle" tag, as well as allowing people to search just by using "water" or "air".
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Re: [Algobox] Algodoo Tag Team

Postby gradyfitz » Sun Dec 05, 2010 2:22 pm

Chronos wrote:I might help out a little.

gradyfitz wrote:VEHICLE - a scene using mechanical design to make a car. This includes up to any extent from gear boxes to basic motors.
LAND VEHICLE - Vehicle with it's primary usage on LAND
WATER VEHICLE - Vehicle with it's primary usage on or in WATER
AIR VEHICLE - Vehicle with it's primary usage in the air (I.e Flying)

I think that the types of vehicle tags should be seperate. E.g., if it's a car the tags should be "land, vehicle" instead of "land vehicle". This eleminates the need to have a "[type] vehicle" tag and a "vehicle" tag, as well as allowing people to search just by using "water" or "air".

Ah, you are right, thanks :thumbup: . I'll make the changes now. Do you think 250, 500 or 1000 is a good size for a "scene block" or do you think that a different number is better?
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Re: [Algobox] Algodoo Tag Team

Postby Mystery » Sun Dec 05, 2010 2:41 pm

250, if you want more you can simply get more after you are done.
I think some sort of guidelines need to be added for the tagging project.
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Re: [Algobox] Algodoo Tag Team

Postby electronicboy » Sun Dec 05, 2010 2:47 pm

ill also consider helping out with it :)

You might also want to do when chronos said to do, to the game section as well as the vehicle section.
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Re: [Algobox] Algodoo Tag Team

Postby Mystery » Sun Dec 05, 2010 3:01 pm

Some of them wouldn't necessarily work on their own like LINEAR GAMES like that it makes sense and fits its description. But when you break it up you get LINEAR and GAME. That could actually make search results worse if anyone was looking for examples of linear physics or such. Same goes with vehicles.
AIR VEHICLE on its own makes sense. AIR and VEHICLE no longer fit the description.
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Re: [Algobox] Algodoo Tag Team

Postby electronicboy » Sun Dec 05, 2010 4:46 pm

it was a suggest, as i don't think that many people will search linear games

Maybe for some of the sections a couple of sub-section them would be better seperated.

Maybe this would also be great as a replacement to the current groups system, obviously it take a bit of work if that happened but i believe it would work well with the tagging.

Or maybe algobox should have a tag browser, possibly spit up into user set and those that are set by this group.
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Re: [Algobox] Algodoo Tag Team

Postby ducky21 » Sun Dec 05, 2010 11:17 pm

I will join. I think we should also have:
MASTERFUL (Paragon Cannon)
FIGHT/BATTLE (Lightsaber duel)
G, PG13, M/ E, T, M (Innapropriate, blody)
Tutorial
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Re: [Algobox] Algodoo Tag Team

Postby electronicboy » Mon Dec 06, 2010 12:14 am

no. The tag system is one of the things that the search use's to find scene's for the search term, thus age rating is pointless.

But i do agree on the tutorial tag.
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Re: [Algobox] Algodoo Tag Team

Postby gradyfitz » Mon Dec 06, 2010 1:37 am

ducky21 wrote:I will join. I think we should also have:
MASTERFUL (Paragon Cannon)
FIGHT/BATTLE (Lightsaber duel)
G, PG13, M/ E, T, M (Innapropriate, blody)
Tutorial

The issue with using tags like "Masterful", "Amazing", "Super Good", etc. is that these are based on personal opinion, and as such, don't have a simple definition. "Fight/Battle" I think could be classified under "COMBAT GAME". With ratings, it could vary from country to country, and you'd probably end up with just G and PG scenes, an M rated scene would probably be quite rare, for these reasons, it's likely that in the event that a scene is very bloody, has a lot of violence and other factors significant enough to warrant an M rating, I think it will probably be mentioned somewhere in the scene itself. And a tutorial tag could be good, perhaps along the lines of:

TUTORIAL - A scene in which the primary focus is on teaching the user how to do something.
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Re: [Algobox] Algodoo Tag Team

Postby ducky21 » Mon Dec 06, 2010 3:42 am

Point taken. Vechicle should be redifined to anything that is made to move. Also:
Contest: a contest base scene
Entry: an entry
Does searching a name of somthing return results? like if I had

Racing Game

with 0 tags and I serched Racing Game would I get it?

Can I do set 42?
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Re: [Algobox] Algodoo Tag Team

Postby Mystery » Mon Dec 06, 2010 4:05 am

As is there are very few tags on algobox so when you search for something algobox scans through only the title and description (and tags but there are very few XD)

I do agree with electronicboy but the problem is to create a tag that accurately portrays its category and it will become something that people don't generally search for. The system at the moment would be great if you knew the list of tags so if you wanted something that flies you could search AIR VEHICLE. My suggestion for this is to get the best of both words first the users applies the correct tag(s) "AIR VEHICLE" and then they create a synonym for that is more relevant to the scene and more likely to be searched "PLANE"

Another question me and Grady were debating last night is which order to do it in.
Oldest to newest would be easiest to make as the pages will never change but most popular to least popular although the order changes (I'm guessing we make a static copy of the order and works from that) the most used scenes will be tags first and even if we only do 1/4 before this collab shuts down we have still done some of the more important scene. Any ideas?
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Re: [Algobox] Algodoo Tag Team

Postby gradyfitz » Mon Dec 06, 2010 4:11 am

ducky21 wrote:Point taken. Vechicle should be redifined to anything that is made to move. Also:
Contest: a contest base scene
Entry: an entry
Does searching a name of somthing return results? like if I had

Racing Game

with 0 tags and I serched Racing Game would I get it?

A walker is not usually considered a vehicle, the definition "anything that is made to move" falls outside of the definition of "vehicle".
Contest and Contest Entry could probably be rolled into just "CONTEST".

I'm not quite sure what you mean. The search box allows you to pick fields to search from (such as Title, description, tags and comments) for your searched text, so if you were looking for a scene named "Racing Game" and searched "Racing Game" with no tags and Title checked, you would find it, though if you had it unchecked and only tags checked, you would not.

The tag system in its current state (underutilized) is somewhat useless, because even when many scenes satisfy a requirement (such as "Mechanism"), you may only get 6 scenes while searching for "Mechanism" in Title and Description results in 314 scenes. I recently used a site with a tag system like Algobox with the exception of having the requirement to add as many tags of possible that apply, it resulted in perhaps 2 results out of 2520 being different to what I was searching for.
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Re: [Algobox] Algodoo Tag Team

Postby gradyfitz » Mon Dec 06, 2010 4:34 am

Mystery wrote:As is there are very few tags on algobox so when you search for something algobox scans through only the title and description (and tags but there are very few XD)

I do agree with electronicboy but the problem is to create a tag that accurately portrays its category and it will become something that people don't generally search for. The system at the moment would be great if you knew the list of tags so if you wanted something that flies you could search AIR VEHICLE. My suggestion for this is to get the best of both words first the users applies the correct tag(s) "AIR VEHICLE" and then they create a synonym for that is more relevant to the scene and more likely to be searched "PLANE"

Another question me and Grady were debating last night is which order to do it in.
Oldest to newest would be easiest to make as the pages will never change but most popular to least popular although the order changes (I'm guessing we make a static copy of the order and works from that) the most used scenes will be tags first and even if we only do 1/4 before this collab shuts down we have still done some of the more important scene. Any ideas?

Yeah.

I think that a list can be very readily available, I think having too many synonyms may take away from the effectiveness of the tag (plane will apply to most "AIR VEHICLE" scenes, so I think it may be fine, but if it gets too specific, very few scenes will have matching tags).

I think lowest scene ID to highest scene ID is a good way to do it, that way you have a consistent continuous set to work from (1000 - 1250 for example), in a situation where it was practical to add every URL in a list and slowly remove them, this could be avoided, unfortunately, doing it that way leaves the scenes in situations where a user will have to check if a scene has been tagged rather than being able to simply look through a set of scenes one by one. There is also the other side that if this collab is dropped and then later picked up, what has been done is clear (such as 17408 - 30000 or something), rather than a huge list of scenes that have been done.

Assuming blocks of 250, I have created a list of sets.
List.rar
Set list (list.txt), decompresses to 1,644KB in rar format.
(33.27 KiB) Downloaded 52 times
or
List.7z
Set list (list.txt), decompresses to 1,644KB in 7z format.
(18.25 KiB) Downloaded 56 times

This would simply aid in choosing set lists (127 progress bar type things are easier to manage than 31,750 links).
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Re: [Algobox] Algodoo Tag Team

Postby ducky21 » Mon Dec 06, 2010 4:40 am

We have a Problem. Air is three letter. Min is four. Max is 12!

A boat is a vechicle. so is a plane
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Re: [Algobox] Algodoo Tag Team

Postby Chronos » Mon Dec 06, 2010 5:53 am

Mystery wrote:As is there are very few tags on algobox so when you search for something algobox scans through only the title and description (and tags but there are very few XD)

I do agree with electronicboy but the problem is to create a tag that accurately portrays its category and it will become something that people don't generally search for. The system at the moment would be great if you knew the list of tags so if you wanted something that flies you could search AIR VEHICLE. My suggestion for this is to get the best of both words first the users applies the correct tag(s) "AIR VEHICLE" and then they create a synonym for that is more relevant to the scene and more likely to be searched "PLANE"

Another question me and Grady were debating last night is which order to do it in.
Oldest to newest would be easiest to make as the pages will never change but most popular to least popular although the order changes (I'm guessing we make a static copy of the order and works from that) the most used scenes will be tags first and even if we only do 1/4 before this collab shuts down we have still done some of the more important scene. Any ideas?

I say we should do the least popular ones first, so that the scenes that aren't getting any recognition have a chance to get some.
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Re: [Algobox] Algodoo Tag Team

Postby Mystery » Mon Dec 06, 2010 6:00 am

Have you seen the least popular scenes?
http://www.algodoo.com/algobox/popular.php?page=999
Who is going to jump on that grenade and do the first 250?
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Re: [Algobox] Algodoo Tag Team

Postby electronicboy » Mon Dec 06, 2010 6:07 pm

Just be sure to make a list of the scene numbers you have done, might save people alot of hassle.
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Re: [Algobox] Algodoo Tag Team

Postby Mystery » Tue Dec 07, 2010 2:13 am

You will be given a set, that set will be for only you to do (you can post some scenes here you are unsure of) when you are done you report it grady will cross it off his huge as list (127 sets i believe) and it will be done.
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Re: [Algobox] Algodoo Tag Team

Postby gradyfitz » Tue Dec 07, 2010 2:35 am

Mystery wrote:You will be given a set, that set will be for only you to do (you can post some scenes here you are unsure of) when you are done you report it grady will cross it off his huge as list (127 sets i believe) and it will be done.

This is the plan, I think at the moment we are just making sure that the tags are at the right level of specificity and the design of the job is correct, everyone knows what to do, etc., I'm planning to keep a progress indication up to date as much as I am able to, so I it would be good to update me on your progress as you work on your set :D.

I'm wondering, do you think this group should do something to ensure that tags applied by this team are identifiable (such as full capitalization, to show that the tag abides by the definition outlined in the tag list here), or do you think it would be better to leave it as just lowercase or lower case with a beginning capital, all of these ways are equal in terms of the result of a search for tags (searching phundamentalist will get you PHUNDAMENTALIST too), but it could be made clear that a scene's tag abides by the defined tag meaning outlined here. What do you think?
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Re: [Algobox] Algodoo Tag Team

Postby Chronos » Tue Dec 07, 2010 8:48 am

I would say to capitalize the first letter, leave the rest lowercase. Looks better than all caps or no caps.
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Re: [Algobox] Algodoo Tag Team

Postby Mystery » Wed Dec 08, 2010 5:21 am

All caps could be handy to know what was left by us.
Even if we do something like ThymE, just for posterity sake.
I think we should get started soon. As soon as Grady gives the go ahead :thumbup:
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Re: [Algobox] Algodoo Tag Team

Postby gradyfitz » Wed Dec 08, 2010 6:34 am

Mystery wrote:All caps could be handy to know what was left by us.
Even if we do something like ThymE, just for posterity sake.
I think we should get started soon. As soon as Grady gives the go ahead :thumbup:

Well, I think most people don't begin tags with capitals, so I think that a first letter capitalization would be significant enough to distinguish these tags from the others. I think we'll change the "AIR", "LAND", "WATER" tags to "AIR VEHICLE", "LAND VEHICLE" and "WATER VEHICLE" (respectively) for consistency, because of:
ducky21 wrote:We have a Problem. Air is three letter. Min is four. Max is 12!

Air must be changed, thus it would make sense to change all three tags, though (regarding the above quote) the max is actually 16 (some tags are longer than 12 characters, so this is worth noting).

After this change I suppose we can begin, though, just as I've got to this point, I've wondered, would you rather be "assigned" sets or to pick them yourself? (this is purely from a starting point, as after that, you can simply move from the set you've just done to the next unassigned set).

Otherwise, the set order will begin as:

Grady - Set 1 (17408 - 17649)
Chronos - Set 2 (17650 - 17899)
Mystery - Set 3 (17900 - 18149)
Electronicboy - Set 4 (18150 - 18399)
Ducky21 - Set 5 (18400 - 18649)

If you begin a new set (please also let us know when you begin your first set), please post in this thread that you have (and which set you have begun), as this will ensure no confusion occurs. Each set is also based on the links in that text document ("List.txt"), so it may be easy to perhaps grab a copy of your set list from that and remove the links as you go through them.
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Re: [Algobox] Algodoo Tag Team

Postby gradyfitz » Wed Dec 08, 2010 10:27 am

I have added the tag "RAGDOLL - A scene which contains a primary component of an object made of many geometries connected to a central point that will fall fluidly. ", do you think this is a significant tag and a correct definition?

The scene I've come across which this tag I think fits is:
Rating: rated 6.9
Filesize: 0.7 MB
Comments: 8
Ratings: 10
download


What do you think?
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Re: [Algobox] Algodoo Tag Team

Postby ducky21 » Thu Dec 09, 2010 1:39 am

I already started set 42. You have it easy, Chronos. :x
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