Trebuchet Contest

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Trebuchet Contest

Postby RA2lover » Fri Nov 20, 2009 2:23 am

Scene
Rating: rated 5
Filesize: 45.87 kB
Comments: 2
Ratings: 1
download

Rules
1- Gravity powered ONLY - exception = extras(primary trigger, recocking, aiming, and other stuff)
2-Max area is the smallest box with 0 degrees angle on which the trebuchet fits with cocked position. that box 's perimeter shouldn't exceed 50 metersCHANGED RULE, CHANGED RULE, CHANGED RULE
3- Max restitution = 0.9, min = 0.1
4-max friction = 5, min = 0.05
5-max weight = 1024 kg(thanks KarateBrot for pointing that out. max weight will still be 1024 kg to prevent rule changing)
5-No fixating/hinging to background(but we provided rails for anchoring/sliding the trebuchet)
6-Use the ammo provided(which IS intended to be hard to use), unless you want to make your own, which must follow previous rules and the rules below:
6.1-Kinetic ONLY(no bombs, rockets and the like)
6.2-Max Density = 100kg/square meter, CSG-add area counts for reading(so that you can't stack a lot of parts)
6.3-Max individual body weight = 150 kilograms(you can use multiple parts in separate bodies, springs and hinges don't separate bodies)
7-Modern kinds of trebuchets are allowed(Examples:Floating axle, King Arthur, Whipper, Merlin)
8-Max counterweight weight = 400 kg

Grading
Formula used = (Distance flown( First bounce on plane counts for reading) / Arm length) / (inAccuracy / arm length(10 launches, the two worse launches don't count)) + Extra factor, judged by me(Loopholes? Plausible to build in real life? Excessive killer usage? Original mechanisms?)
(formula changed due to excess of negative numbers and too high accounting for inaccuracy)
Uploading
Entries should be uploaded before December 15, 2009 @ 12:00PM GMT

Current entries(Some ratings are pendent):

1st: Davidz - (previous one)15.31, new one = 21.46 points
Rating: rated 6.8
Filesize: 38.46 kB
Comments: 8
Ratings: 5
download
Last edited by RA2lover on Sun Nov 22, 2009 9:44 pm, edited 5 times in total.
Jrv wrote:
TC42 wrote:Quite honestly, I didn't think anyone on 4chan has that good a use of grammar, spelling, usage, mechanics, ect.
But I've never been there, so I may be wrong.


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Re: Trebuchet Contest

Postby KarateBrot » Fri Nov 20, 2009 4:45 am

sounds interesting.
are we allowed to use scripting?

btw 1 metric ton is exactly 1000kg
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Re: Trebuchet Contest

Postby lethalsquirrel » Fri Nov 20, 2009 7:26 am

well the rules seem pretty strict but that just equals more fun! im gonna give this one my best shot! :thumbup:
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Re: Trebuchet Contest

Postby davidz40 » Fri Nov 20, 2009 3:20 pm

Rating: rated 6.8
Filesize: 38.46 kB
Comments: 8
Ratings: 5
download
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Re: Trebuchet Contest

Postby RA2lover » Fri Nov 20, 2009 6:00 pm

davidz40 wrote:
Rating: rated 6.8
Filesize: 38.46 kB
Comments: 8
Ratings: 5
download

Invalid entry, counterweight weights more than 400 kg. also, its SLIGHTLY larger than 50 meter area(but with an offset weight that can be fixed).
Jrv wrote:
TC42 wrote:Quite honestly, I didn't think anyone on 4chan has that good a use of grammar, spelling, usage, mechanics, ect.
But I've never been there, so I may be wrong.


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Re: Trebuchet Contest

Postby davidz40 » Fri Nov 20, 2009 7:41 pm

Fixed my entry.
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Re: Trebuchet Contest

Postby lethalsquirrel » Fri Nov 20, 2009 8:02 pm

Rating: rated 6.5
Filesize: 0.52 MB
Comments: 3
Ratings: 5
download


heres my entry. please let me know if i broke any rules
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Re: Trebuchet Contest

Postby RA2lover » Fri Nov 20, 2009 10:00 pm

Davidz's entry 2 Still invalid - 0 friction is below requirements...
almost rated it(which, by the numbers resulted, requires me to modify the formula)...
Last edited by RA2lover on Fri Nov 20, 2009 10:06 pm, edited 1 time in total.
Jrv wrote:
TC42 wrote:Quite honestly, I didn't think anyone on 4chan has that good a use of grammar, spelling, usage, mechanics, ect.
But I've never been there, so I may be wrong.


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Re: Trebuchet Contest

Postby RA2lover » Fri Nov 20, 2009 10:02 pm

Lethalssquirl's entry is too large - try to make it more compact.

edit: typo
Jrv wrote:
TC42 wrote:Quite honestly, I didn't think anyone on 4chan has that good a use of grammar, spelling, usage, mechanics, ect.
But I've never been there, so I may be wrong.


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Re: Trebuchet Contest

Postby davidz40 » Sat Nov 21, 2009 12:40 pm

Only one part (arm) had 0 friction by mistake, but it doesn't collide with anything so it doesn't really matter.
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Re: Trebuchet Contest

Postby RA2lover » Sat Nov 21, 2009 5:17 pm

David's entry raging
Average distance flown = 378.7 meters.
with a 14 meter long arm, that equals to 27.05 arm lengths.
Inaccuracy reading
Launch distances
427 422 409 [s]435[/s] 348 404 324 299 [s]288[/s] 431
48.3, 43.3, 30.3, 30.7, 25.3, 54.7, 79.7, 52.3
average of them = 45.575 meters
divided by arm length = 3.25535714 arms of innacuracy
27.05 / 3.25535714 equals to 8.30938015 score points!
Bonuses
Structural stress in real life -4
Parts without collision groups used -1(increases difficulty of real-life construction)
Originality of mechanism +5
No killers used +2
Likes to lean itself(result of a low base, which by the strict rules is understandable)-1
Non-smooth projectile acceleration curve -1
Easy reloading process +1
Nice, effective space usage +3
Very Small base but still stable at firing +3
Total = 7 points bonus.
Total score = 15.31(rounded), 15.30938015(i doubt the entries will need a better degree of scoring accuracy) points!(Expected average was around 11 points)
Jrv wrote:
TC42 wrote:Quite honestly, I didn't think anyone on 4chan has that good a use of grammar, spelling, usage, mechanics, ect.
But I've never been there, so I may be wrong.


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Re: Trebuchet Contest

Postby Razorhead » Sun Nov 22, 2009 1:03 am

Here's my entry. I hope it's valid, there were quite a few rules :)

Rating: rated 5
Filesize: 45.38 kB
Comments: 1
Ratings: 1
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Re: Trebuchet Contest

Postby RA2lover » Sun Nov 22, 2009 1:31 am

Entry too big.even with changed rule

Looks like i got to edit the rules accounting for cluster projectiles. i'll need to improve the grenade explosion script(by adding a velocity variable), or just to defuse it prior to launch...
Last edited by RA2lover on Sun Nov 22, 2009 9:51 pm, edited 1 time in total.
Jrv wrote:
TC42 wrote:Quite honestly, I didn't think anyone on 4chan has that good a use of grammar, spelling, usage, mechanics, ect.
But I've never been there, so I may be wrong.


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Re: Trebuchet Contest

Postby Razorhead » Sun Nov 22, 2009 2:25 am

Whats the rules with the explosives? How do you count mid-air explosions? It's hard to fling a grenade very far in 7 seconds :)

Anyways. Here's my dead accurate trebuchet :)
Rating: rated 5
Filesize: 56.56 kB
Comments: 1
Ratings: 1
download
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Re: Trebuchet Contest

Postby RA2lover » Sun Nov 22, 2009 3:47 pm

If the trebuchet has a very high likehood of airbusting the grenades, then they will be defused for easier reading.(PS:the grenades are intended to arm themselves not in launch, but after impact.
something similar to a booby trap. Image
For cluster projectiles, each submunition hitting the ground counts as one throw.

still, it's too large. 50 squaremeter area(measured with box, example = Davidz's entry) max. hovewer, i might change the sample trebuchet to something smaller, or decrease the strictness of it

update
Razorhead's trebuchet counterweight is still heavier than rules permit(402 kg - counting bar hidden behind it which is holding it)
Last edited by RA2lover on Sun Nov 22, 2009 9:54 pm, edited 1 time in total.
Jrv wrote:
TC42 wrote:Quite honestly, I didn't think anyone on 4chan has that good a use of grammar, spelling, usage, mechanics, ect.
But I've never been there, so I may be wrong.


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Re: Trebuchet Contest

Postby Nxdt » Sun Nov 22, 2009 4:59 pm

I don't like the 50 Square meter rule, it means that conventional trebuchets have to fit in a tiny box, mabye you should change the rules so that the X and Y dimentions of the box add up to 25, this allows larger machines and limits the size well.
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Re: Trebuchet Contest

Postby RA2lover » Sun Nov 22, 2009 6:24 pm

OK, Rule change accepted.
i'll check the other entries to see if they are still valid later(i'm on my friend's computer, runs phun beta 4(beta 5 won't work). it's possible to un-zip the phz files, but it takes too much of a time, and as algodoo is MUCH more different than phun beta 4, it can cause issues with the current entries.
Jrv wrote:
TC42 wrote:Quite honestly, I didn't think anyone on 4chan has that good a use of grammar, spelling, usage, mechanics, ect.
But I've never been there, so I may be wrong.


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Re: Trebuchet Contest

Postby davidz40 » Sun Nov 22, 2009 7:30 pm

So now the biggest area avaliable if about 150sqm (12.5*12.5)?
I need to rescale my machie :/

EDIT
updated my trebuchet. Did not change anything other than making it higher and changing shooting angle a bit, which resulted in almost doubling range.
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Re: Trebuchet Contest

Postby RA2lover » Sun Nov 22, 2009 9:56 pm

KarateBrot wrote:sounds interesting.
are we allowed to use scripting?


Didn't noticed that part... yes, scripting IS allowed, but it shouldn't change the physical attributes of objects.
Jrv wrote:
TC42 wrote:Quite honestly, I didn't think anyone on 4chan has that good a use of grammar, spelling, usage, mechanics, ect.
But I've never been there, so I may be wrong.


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Re: Trebuchet Contest

Postby Nxdt » Mon Nov 23, 2009 6:55 pm

Okay heres my entry, I found that the simplest of designs are often the best;
Rating: rated 5.3
Filesize: 46.71 kB
Comments: 0
Ratings: 2
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Re: Trebuchet Contest

Postby Razorhead » Wed Nov 25, 2009 1:21 am

Edited the counterweight, added a ruler. I must admit I'm a bit puzzled about the size rules... A nice, big transparent square to build in would aid me, atleast :)

Trebuchet still accurate like Almighty God himself :)

Rating: rated 5
Filesize: 56.56 kB
Comments: 1
Ratings: 1
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Re: Trebuchet Contest

Postby Sniperkasa » Wed Nov 25, 2009 2:48 pm

Okay i tried..
Rating: rated 5.6
Filesize: 34.03 kB
Comments: 0
Ratings: 2
download

If you want to make it legit.. just cut off as much as needed from the counterweight holding boxes... [I think its needed.. not sure.]
If you have a question, have a dollar and call somebody that cares.
No really just PM me if you have a problem :)
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Re: Trebuchet Contest

Postby daniels220 » Thu Dec 03, 2009 1:25 am

lethalsquirl, your entry is awesome. It's realistic an an excellent implementation of a FAT (which is itself a really cool design). The throwing motion is totally awesome and fluid.

I thought I'd have some fun with it, though, and see if I couldn't come up with something that would throw farther. You only used about 150KG of counterweight, after all... (Rules, I know, but the no-body-heavier-than-150kg rule is relatively easy to circumvent).

So then here is the result. This is not really an entry, since really a lot of it is lethalsquirl's (though if you want to grade it and credit it to both of us, I did try to make it follow the rules). What it is is a benchmark of how hard and far it's possible to throw with this amount of counterweight.

Rating: rated 5.5
Filesize: 499.35 kB
Comments: 3
Ratings: 2
download


Of course, this scene is totally unrealistic—the beam would shatter into a hundred pieces when that wheel hits it. And this treb isn't all that accurate, though I don't think it's horribly inaccurate either.

EDIT: Just realized the ammo is too light. This design would need tuning to throw 5kg (shorter arm, better arm guides). I built a different design instead—see below.
Last edited by daniels220 on Fri Dec 04, 2009 1:52 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Trebuchet Contest

Postby RA2lover » Thu Dec 03, 2009 2:17 pm

no, a 150 kg limit is only for custom-made ammunition, not the trebuchet itself, which has the max weight and the counterweight weight limitations
Jrv wrote:
TC42 wrote:Quite honestly, I didn't think anyone on 4chan has that good a use of grammar, spelling, usage, mechanics, ect.
But I've never been there, so I may be wrong.


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Re: Trebuchet Contest

Postby daniels220 » Thu Dec 03, 2009 6:52 pm

RA2Lover, I meant the 150kg per "body" limit, which I got around by putting the weights in a box. lethalsquirl fixed them to the same body, so the total weight of arm+slide+sling+weights couldn't be >150kg.

EDIT: Oh, I see that now. Well the workaround was rather effective, so I don't see the need to revisit that treb. But I also realized I had at some point adjusted the density of the ammo down, and with that arm ratio the modified treb can hardly even throw the full 5kg.

So I made an entirely original one, instead, with a different design. It's a FAKA—floating-arm King Arthur. In the real world, they're quite difficult to build. In Phun, not so much.

I think this is by far the hardest-throwing treb of the bunch, and I might be able to make it better by changing the short-arm to long-arm ratio.

Rating: rated 5.6
Filesize: 18.47 kB
Comments: 1
Ratings: 2
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